exvelocity

They will not be able to remove/sand just the clearcoat without disturbing basecoat color ,what they are telling you is that they will scuff and sand the existing clearcoat to remove gloss/shine,so that new paint/clear will adhere .Usually it's done with red or gray scuff pad and prep paste or 600-1000 grit sandpaper,or combination of scuff pads and paper . It's a regular procedure when painting .

ajaxahi

They were actually saying they WOULD disturb the basecoat a bit - they said they would sand some of it off. This is not just a panel blend we are talking about, where they just scuff up the clear, but a total repaint of all panels. I'm wondering if this approach sounds okay (it sounds to me like what they normally do when they repaint a panel - they don't just scuff up the clear and paint over it they remove it and go into the color coat), or if I should just steer clear and leave well enough alone?

Guitarman

Wow...that's difficult to believe...Please make sure you are understanding them, and that they are telling you this specifically....If they're truly saying they will be sanding through the clear to the basecoat during prep, then they don't know much about respraying a car for color mismatch, and I'd avoid them touching it again.

exvelocity is perfectly correct, you ALWAYS scarify the clear and nothing more. Once you break through it, then you've got other problems to deal with, involving more time and $$$. I've never heard of a shop that tries to remove just the clear. Technically, it's not feasible. If that was a goal, they would save man hours and $$$ by just stripping the panel and starting over from scratch.

If you don't think you mis-heard them, I'd go elsewhere to remedy the situation if possible (I do understand you don't want to pay again... so it's a tough choice).

Communication is everything for you & them right now.

ajaxahi

Thanks Guitarman and exvelocity. It is possible I misunderstood them. But if they just repaint by scarifying only the clear, then it sounds I would be getting an inferior product, correct? I may end up having paint that looks worse (with rings and stuff as exvelocity described above) and is significantly thicker than now. Is it you guys' opinion that I should insist on the repaint with stripping back down to the metal or not do anything?

Also, some others on these forums have suggested that maybe the color mismatch isn't so bad and can be improved with a good detailer. Like I keep saying, it looks virtually undetectable most of the day and in the shade. I took it back to this shop for another polish, but I don't think their guy is very good, because the swirl marks and holograms are still there, as is the color mismatch.

This is a big deal so I don't want to make any hasty moves. And now from a smallish dent in the rear door at first, now we are talking about almost the entire passenger side! As always I appreciate your comments...

ajaxahi

P.S. - I suppose I could insist on them stripping down to bare metal and offer to pay for the extra labor if they object. I don't like the idea of them just painting on roughed-up clear as I don't want it to be so thick. And boy I am nervous about someone touching my wife's car again and further messing it up! Tempted to just do nothing at this point.

Guitarman

I think you've misunderstood exvelocity's explanation...you've got it backwards, if they DO CUT THROUGH to the basecolor, THEN you will see rings and halos from the layering of clear/ base cut through.

If they ONLY scuff the clear, you will have a flat finish as you do now, only (hopefully) better color matching.

Hope that helps.

ajaxahi

Thanks guitarman. So let's assume they do it right and only scuff the clear. Is this a solution to avoid since it will result in a color coat over clear and also the total thickness will be getting to much?

Guitarman

Body shops ( and myself) spray new paint over scuffed clear ALL the time. As for the paint thickness, that can be an issue after a certain point, whether you're nearing it I've no idea. Only a thickness gauge can determine that. You need to ask them if they will warranty the paint based on the paint thickness, and make your decision.

Good luck

ajaxahi

Okay well I guess that's good to hear. And at least they stripped everything down to the metal before they did this job, so I'm assuming the paint thickness isn't too bad at this point, but it wouldn't hurt to get someone to measure it. Now I just need to make a decision!

For resale in 5 years or so, what so you think would be better... the status quo, with slightly mismatched panels, or having the whole passenger side repainted in the way you guys describe (scuff clear, then repaint) to a more even color but more paint thickness (maybe raising questions if a trade-in dealer puts his paint meter on it)? OR I could insist on stripping again, but probably have to pay for the extra labor on that, plus longer wait time for my wife?

Guys, based on all the above, what would YOU do???

Guitarman

Me, I'd have them respray the work they did and get the color match right. IMO, given your info, I don't think the paint thickness is going to be an issue, but leaving it as it is, will be on resale.

Best wishes.

ajaxahi

Thanks guitarman. So you don't think I should insist on having it stripped, which will add time and possibly expense? A normal repaint and I'm done?

Also, should I ask about tinting (they just used the factory color code unchanged), or just leave that up to them? There is quite a color difference between the front fender and the bumper with this paint. I guess the rear door came out nice and dark with the same paint, so maybe it was just the technique that was used...

And does the amount of coats put on darken the color? Could it be the rear door got more coats of paint and that's why it looks darker?

Guitarman

As I said, If it were me, I'd have them scuff & respray, not strip, but that's me.

The paint thickness has nothing to do with how well they will match the color the next time anyway.

There are hundreds of variables that can affect the color match, I think exvelocity covered some of these in a previous answer in this thread. He knows what he's talking about.

There's a local body shop near me, The Body Werks, that does high end stuff, Mercedes, BMW, Lexus, Porsche, Ferrari etc. and I go there for advice when I have a problem spraying myself. Once on the topic of matching, they told me their story of a SC 430 in the tri-coat (pearl) dark red, in for a repair. They told me they had a "factory pack" color mix, matching the OEM, but had to spray the panel 4 Times (!) before they got a correct match in all lighting conditions.

They are VERY good at what they do, so this shows you the variables and complexity. This is what it takes. The shop needs to be willing to do that. Many are not.

Dan

ajaxahi

Thanks so much Dan for all your helpful comments. I'm going to show the car to a few more people for opinions, but I'm leaning toward doing what you would do. This is a high-end shop (not the highest, but mid-high) and as someone else said on this thread, they wouldn't be offering to repaint if they didn't see something wrong too, even though they aren't admitting it. I just wish you guys could see the car in person rather than relying on pictures. Anyway, thanks again, having good people on these forums to talk to about this honestly may have saved my marriage!

ajaxahi

p.s. Dan on that story abouut the SC 430, does that mean they did color, clear, color, clear, color, clear, color, clear... with just a little scuffing of the clear in between? Man, I guess I shouldn't be so worried about one repaint then!

ajaxahi

Shoot, one more question. As you guys know, this job consisted of of them painting the rear quarter, rear door and front door... they also blended into the front fender which exvelocity point out looks like they blended all the way to the front bumper, with a bad color match. If we do the re-paint, will they now have to paint the entire front fender which was previously blended? It seems that with each re-paint, the affected area gets bigger and bigger. Next thing I know they'll be painting my hood and my bumpers! How can I avoid that?