macdee

OK guys, the price hike for 4RX in Japan is pretty much official.

Called my dealer and they got official prices yesterday.
I'm shooting for a 450h L model, so that's what I have asked.

In short, prices for BASE model, pre-consumption tax, in Japan:
- original 3RX 450h 2WD L model (in 2010): 5,714,286 yen (about 45,985 USD)
- new 4RX 450h 2WD L model price: 6,504,629 yen (about 52,345 USD)

One of the reasons, as I have been told, was that now all the safety features are included in base config and are not optional. Not quite sure what exactly these included feature are, though, at least at this point (and no, you can't remove them to lower the price now).

All markets are surely different and price change might not be that big for US or UK or wherever… but just for reference.

I'm visiting my dealership tomorrow to get a proper quote for the config I want so should be more info that time (option prices are already known as well).
In addition, my dealer have spent several days studying the 4RX at Lexus as well, so he has first hand driving experience. I'll check how he liked everything…

Will update once I have more info.

PS: Official announcement in Japan is October 22nd btw, and "if you're lucky" the delivery could happen by the end of October. (again, Japan)

corradoMR2

Thanks for posting. About a 15% price hike is steep but that is in comparison to 6 years ago. What was the RX's price with nearly the same equipment for MY 2015?

rayaans

Yep like I said £71k for a loaded premier in the UK. Currently at £60K with all safety systems added.

I think the 450h is $73k in the US

macdee

OK guys I'm back with a bit more info.

I was getting a quote on 450h version L, 2WD model, so talking only about that model (any prices mentioned are pre-consumption tax, in USD)

First of all, price-related stuff.
- the list of maker options got quite a bit smaller than before. really…*about probably 10-15 items. These 4RXes really have like everything included in base configuration.

Tires:
- by default, 450h comes with 20-inch tires (5 sections of 3 spikes design)
- you can choose from 2 additional options:
1) "noise reduction" tires (same design as default, a bit different metallic color), which would run you extra $240
2) tires with 5 color-interchangeable inserts (Lexus-first). Default set (I believe it was white) would run you extra $120; if you want to change color inserts from the default color to one of 4 available, that's an additional extra $240 (so around $350 in total)
I think I'm going with noise reduction, but haven't decided yet.

Front lights:
- automatic high beam is included by default, BUT you can add a little extra and have an adaptive high beam system installed. What is does: front lights consist of 3 sections, and each section can move up/down independently, giving better granularity on where beams light straight up, and where they are pointed down. I'm going with this system, just for the fun of it (dealer said it was pretty fun and noticeable to drive with this system installed). That's extra: $360

Audio:
My biggest mistake when buying 3RX was not getting Mark Levinson audio. Fixing it now. Same price as before (may be even slightly cheaper). Extra: $1680. ML audio adds 3 additional speakers: a tweeter at front-center location, and 2 surround speakers around trunk area. Also slightly different specs for other speakers. 15 in total for Mark Levinson, 12 speakers in standard configuration.

Floor mats:
Huge shock here… I'm riding a white 3RX, and planning to get another white (different white though) 4RX. This time around, there are NO white/ivory/whatever light floor mat option. Only black and light brown. Duh… I love my ivory ones. Where I live, roads are very clean so having light-colored floor mats wasn't a chore at all. Would have to go with the brown option now. (I'm getting "rich cream" leather interior, so probably won't be too bad). Mats are their usual price, same as before. Around $740

Some of the other options were:
- LED interior set (overhead lamp, trunk area and other non-critical places). About $180 extra, but I decided to skip.
- hatch or moonroof (no way I'm getting this stuff in Japan - sun is way to strong for a good part of the year, and I'll burn alive). Believe prices were around the usual prices for these options. $700-800?…
- back seat entertainment system. About $1800 extra.


And… that's about it. Not counting body coat, ETC, 3D number plate, anti-theft bolts and such. These are usual stuff.

Actually, in the end, I felt the price hike is quite justified.
Some things you get by default:
- automatic high beam system
- 360 view parking monitor
- power back door with touch-less open (that was the default option… right)
- Lexus safety + system: blind spot monitor, lane keep assist, back/front sonars, laser cruise control
- HUD was default in L before…*but anyways, it comes with that installed as well (and as said, it's literally 6.5 times bigger)


Now that's what I got from dealer who actually spent few days test-driving the new RX, LX and…*some other new Lexus model (I could care less about, so, sorry

In no particular order, a stream on consciousness
- 4RX "feels" big. Noticeably bigger than 3RX, even though the difference is really 10cm in length, 1cm in width, and 2cm in height. The reason is due to it's design, and quite a bit due to the shape of the bonnet/hood. Feels quite a bit bigger vs NX, and still felt big even after looking at LX.
- can't see edge of bonnet when driving, unlike 3RX where you could at least see a part of it
- getting in and out is easier due to seat location being lowered
- driving feels more "sporty" alike to IS, due to change in angles of seat and steering wheel (feels much better)
- much less body roll, and the center of weight (and the car overall) feels noticeably lower
- better sound isolation (sound isolating material runs from engine room to under back seats, and is twice as thick vs 3RX)
- back button on remote touch is very useful
- got apologized for remote touchpad in previous models ("we f'd up…")
- there is a place on the center panel where you were supposed to put your mobile phone (right next to remote touch). It was designed to fit iPhone 5, or something slightly bigger, and was finalized before Apple's iPhone 6 announcement. So you guessed it - iPhone 6 won't fit. They even renamed that that place to just "storage box", and supposedly it was called something more related to mobile phone storage or something. Originally, they planned for wires to run from USB ports located inside the larger "storage box" just behind this smaller one, right into the mobile phone placed there. However, they had to rethink the central panel a bit and create a small "cave" in front, so for all iPhone 6 folks, you would not have to run wires through the whole central panel. Lexus comment was basically "Ooops… "
- the glasses holder is indeed back, and they seem to be pretty proud of the design efforts went into that thing…
- leather quality is "similar to BMW, but softer and felt better". Never had a BMW so I have no idea…
- navigation LCD is richer in colors and brighter
- front lights don't turn left/right like in 3RX (they only move up/down), but instead there's the "cornering" LCD light located near fog lamp, and turns on when the car is turning. "Looks very good and stylish"
- dynamics is noticeably better vs 3RX 450h (2WD models). "Feels much less bulky", much less body roll than current 3RX
- AWD 450h feels a bit bulky comparing to 2WD
- 200t feels very "light" and dynamic, but 2WD feels a bit unbalanced with lots of weight in front and not so much at back. 200t AWD felt more balanced
- for 450h, 2WD seemed like a better option, unless you really want AWD
- looks like lots and lots of thoughts went into the new approach angle (decrease from 28 to 17 degrees). So well…*just to that you know
- for F Sports, there's nearly zero body roll, but since the test drive was performed on a drive circuit, it was not possible to determine the difference in suspension quality vs L versions
- overall, liked the new RX quite a bit and it "felt like a completely different car".

So well guys…*hope you find this interesting. I surely did.

melodyqi

Thank you macdee, that is a lot of good information. I saw one blog mention the US base price will start at $47,620. If that is true, that is more than 16% increase. I cannot wait for the official pricing and specs to come out for the U.S. market. You mentioned the new RX overall feels lower to the ground. Do you know its ground clearance spec?

Bearcat

Even though cost isn't a factor for me, a 15%+ increase in cost does seem pretty steep. It will be interesting if that plays any factor in sales though because for a lot of people $7k-$10k is a lot of money.

Cjl22

Macdee,

Can you supply cargo specs behind the second row and with the second row folded flat....thanks




I was getting a quote on 450h version L, 2WD model, so talking only about that model (any prices mentioned are pre-consumption tax, in USD)

First of all, price-related stuff.
- the list of maker options got quite a bit smaller than before. really…*about probably 10-15 items. These 4RXes really have like everything included in base configuration.

Tires:
- by default, 450h comes with 20-inch tires (5 sections of 3 spikes design)
- you can choose from 2 additional options:
1) "noise reduction" tires (same design as default, a bit different metallic color), which would run you extra $240
2) tires with 5 color-interchangeable inserts (Lexus-first). Default set (I believe it was white) would run you extra $120; if you want to change color inserts from the default color to one of 4 available, that's an additional extra $240 (so around $350 in total)
I think I'm going with noise reduction, but haven't decided yet.

Front lights:
- automatic high beam is included by default, BUT you can add a little extra and have an adaptive high beam system installed. What is does: front lights consist of 3 sections, and each section can move up/down independently, giving better granularity on where beams light straight up, and where they are pointed down. I'm going with this system, just for the fun of it (dealer said it was pretty fun and noticeable to drive with this system installed). That's extra: $360

Audio:
My biggest mistake when buying 3RX was not getting Mark Levinson audio. Fixing it now. Same price as before (may be even slightly cheaper). Extra: $1680. ML audio adds 3 additional speakers: a tweeter at front-center location, and 2 surround speakers around trunk area. Also slightly different specs for other speakers. 15 in total for Mark Levinson, 12 speakers in standard configuration.

Floor mats:
Huge shock here… I'm riding a white 3RX, and planning to get another white (different white though) 4RX. This time around, there are NO white/ivory/whatever light floor mat option. Only black and light brown. Duh… I love my ivory ones. Where I live, roads are very clean so having light-colored floor mats wasn't a chore at all. Would have to go with the brown option now. (I'm getting "rich cream" leather interior, so probably won't be too bad). Mats are their usual price, same as before. Around $740

Some of the other options were:
- LED interior set (overhead lamp, trunk area and other non-critical places). About $180 extra, but I decided to skip.
- hatch or moonroof (no way I'm getting this stuff in Japan - sun is way to strong for a good part of the year, and I'll burn alive). Believe prices were around the usual prices for these options. $700-800?…
- back seat entertainment system. About $1800 extra.


And… that's about it. Not counting body coat, ETC, 3D number plate, anti-theft bolts and such. These are usual stuff.

Actually, in the end, I felt the price hike is quite justified.
Some things you get by default:
- automatic high beam system
- 360 view parking monitor
- power back door with touch-less open (that was the default option… right)
- Lexus safety + system: blind spot monitor, lane keep assist, back/front sonars, laser cruise control
- HUD was default in L before…*but anyways, it comes with that installed as well (and as said, it's literally 6.5 times bigger)


Now that's what I got from dealer who actually spent few days test-driving the new RX, LX and…*some other new Lexus model (I could care less about, so, sorry

In no particular order, a stream on consciousness
- 4RX "feels" big. Noticeably bigger than 3RX, even though the difference is really 10cm in length, 1cm in width, and 2cm in height. The reason is due to it's design, and quite a bit due to the shape of the bonnet/hood. Feels quite a bit bigger vs NX, and still felt big even after looking at LX.
- can't see edge of bonnet when driving, unlike 3RX where you could at least see a part of it
- getting in and out is easier due to seat location being lowered
- driving feels more "sporty" alike to IS, due to change in angles of seat and steering wheel (feels much better)
- much less body roll, and the center of weight (and the car overall) feels noticeably lower
- better sound isolation (sound isolating material runs from engine room to under back seats, and is twice as thick vs 3RX)
- back button on remote touch is very useful
- got apologized for remote touchpad in previous models ("we f'd up…")
- there is a place on the center panel where you were supposed to put your mobile phone (right next to remote touch). It was designed to fit iPhone 5, or something slightly bigger, and was finalized before Apple's iPhone 6 announcement. So you guessed it - iPhone 6 won't fit. They even renamed that that place to just "storage box", and supposedly it was called something more related to mobile phone storage or something. Originally, they planned for wires to run from USB ports located inside the larger "storage box" just behind this smaller one, right into the mobile phone placed there. However, they had to rethink the central panel a bit and create a small "cave" in front, so for all iPhone 6 folks, you would not have to run wires through the whole central panel. Lexus comment was basically "Ooops… "
- the glasses holder is indeed back, and they seem to be pretty proud of the design efforts went into that thing…
- leather quality is "similar to BMW, but softer and felt better". Never had a BMW so I have no idea…
- navigation LCD is richer in colors and brighter
- front lights don't turn left/right like in 3RX (they only move up/down), but instead there's the "cornering" LCD light located near fog lamp, and turns on when the car is turning. "Looks very good and stylish"
- dynamics is noticeably better vs 3RX 450h (2WD models). "Feels much less bulky", much less body roll than current 3RX
- AWD 450h feels a bit bulky comparing to 2WD
- 200t feels very "light" and dynamic, but 2WD feels a bit unbalanced with lots of weight in front and not so much at back. 200t AWD felt more balanced
- for 450h, 2WD seemed like a better option, unless you really want AWD
- looks like lots and lots of thoughts went into the new approach angle (decrease from 28 to 17 degrees). So well…*just to that you know
- for F Sports, there's nearly zero body roll, but since the test drive was performed on a drive circuit, it was not possible to determine the difference in suspension quality vs L versions
- overall, liked the new RX quite a bit and it "felt like a completely different car".

So well guys…*hope you find this interesting. I surely did.[/QUOTE]

sakaike

It's a factor for me, and made me recently conclude that I will be shopping for a 3RX and buying it in the next month or two. I posted this sentiment in one of the 3RX threads recently.

The conclusion I reached is that the price gap is actually much greater than the difference in MSRP. Everyone here has been saying that upon release, the 4RX is likely to sell for MSRP and I believe that based on pricing for initial release of earlier generations. Couple that with the fact that the 3RX can currently be had for substantially less than MSRP, and the gap widens even further than $7-$10k - more like maybe $15k.

That's too much for me, even though I really wanted the 4RX.

Edit to add that I can't wait for prices to come down, however long that might take. Our current 2004 2RX has 215000 miles on it and needs to be replaced...

macdee

Sorry…*completely forgot to look at the clearance spec (with exception to the approach angle - the change which was pretty prominently outlined in the pamphlet…).
But as far as I understand, this overall feeling comes mainly from two things:
- lower center of weight of the car itself
- different position of the seats (lower and with slightly different angle?…)

I'll have another look at the specs, but it'll probably happen not sooner than in next week or two, when I'll probably go forward with actual pre-order. Hopefully there'll be more info from others by that time as well! I'm not allowed to make any photos, so taking out just what I can fit inside my head…

macdee

Sorry…*All I remember is +18mm extra space added to back seats and another 20mm added to the trunk area.
Not even sure if they had any specific dimensions beside these two. But I'll have a look next time I visit my dealer (which might not happen in next 1-2wks though…)

macdee

Regarding the price increase. Just dug out my old quote and there are a couple of other things I've forgot I had to add for extra money to the 3RX 450h 2WD L model:

- pre-crash safety system
- tires upgrade from 18 to 19 inches,
That was extra $1350. Now included in base config.

Another thing which I would have LOVED to add on 3RX, but couldn't, because it just was not available, was tire pressure indication. Now, it is included on all models by default.

So these things kinda add up to at least partially justify the hike. At least for people who want to have these features in the first place. For others, though, it feels more like a force feeding…

But they definitely HAD to differentiate NX and RX in terms of pricing, which they did. Common business sense, I guess…

One thing I forgot to mention is that my dealer said that 4RX interior feels "one or two ranks up vs the old RX". Can see that on the pics, but first-hand experience still matters.

GSteg

iTrader: (15)

Any details on the 450h drivetrain? Is it pretty much a carryover from the 3RX with a 5hp power bump?

I personally think they should have released the vehicle under a different name instead of calling it the RX. One of the reason why the RX is so successful is because of it's value and price-point. It still has value judging from the lists of standard features, but the price has gone up quite a bit that it might alienate buyers. What will Lexus offer customers who want something larger than the NX, but can't justify the price of the 4RX? The 3RX fills that role rather nicely.

macdee

Except for the bump (HP and max torque, both within single (higher) digit percents), it looks like things are mainly the same. There were some words about improving performance and stuff. But it feels like not even evolution, but just an extremely refined fine-tuning.
There was a graph for torque at specific RPMs for both 200t and 350, but this stuff is so outside my area of knowledge that I can't really comprehend what it means (and was unable to take a photo so far).

So as far as I understand:
- electric motors are basically the same
- engine is slightly more effective. Mileage increased by 0.2km/l (ha-ha)
- engine itself was relocated to a lower position, so there's much less roll

but that's about all I remember and was able to understand. Aside from engine relocation, doesn't sound like anything ground-breaking at all. Sure they must've tuned something else I don't even have an idea it exists, or can be tuned - since, as said, during the tests, there was much less feeling of the "weight" of the car.

mikeivan

Thanks for all this information, lots to absorb and interpret

- original 3RX 450h 2WD L model (in 2010): (about 45,985 USD)
- new 4RX 450h 2WD L model price: (about 52,345 USD)

I make this to be 13.8% increase over a 6 year time period, seems modest to me. Am I doing the math correctly?

- AWD 450h feels a bit bulky comparing to 2WD
- for 450h, 2WD seemed like a better option, unless you really want AWD

Not sure what "bulky" means here, did he mean "heavy". I am considering AWD because I think it will improve the ride, by adding weight, especially in the rear. All US 2016 RX will have eight speed transmissions, correct?

Lowering the engine in the frame is a big deal, imho. Can't wait to see the actual brochure when it comes out.

rayaans

The CVT is new buddy. Been told it's rather good apparently. Even better than the Cvt on the current GS450H which by no means is bad at all.

Hybrid whine has been reduced. You won't hear it inside the car anymore unlike you do atm.

With the 10kg weight saving and the lower feeling of weight, it'll be a perfectly good system for the RX. Current RX450h hits 60 on a full charge in 7s flat and pulls pretty hard from 30 - 80mph which is what really matters anyway! As long as they are true to their word on the driving experience and less feeling of weight, I'll happily buy a 450h F Sport.