1WILLY1

iTrader: (9)

^^^cool , well i admited i never ran a stretch set up but i also admit that i would love to, purely for the looks .

i also think that forsure it compromises the integrity of the wheel.

thats all im saying.

thanks

BartleDoo

iTrader: (1)

225 is stock on the 400.

Much of what you said in that post is completely illogical. Of course they had to run wider tires many years ago to get the same traction of a newer and narrower tire. Tread compounds are vastly improved. Saying that stretched tires handle better and that wider tires don't improve grip/traction... Stretched tires give a more positive response feeling at initial turn in but that's it. It may feel like an improvement, but overall grip diminishes.

On another note, I was only stating my opinion just like you were before. I don't understand something here that has become increasingly apparent on CL. Why is it that it's all fine and dandy when people want to express their opinion advocating modifications that are 100% proven to be detrimental to performance and safety (don't care what any non-engineer says about it being safe or done since the big-bang whatever it's BS and definitely less safe and if you knew how to prove it yourself then we wouldn't have these types of arguments), but when someone like myself expresses their own opinion without attacking anybody it becomes some sort of wrong doing? Why are the people advocating the truly correct way (not trying to bash on the aesthetic types who do these things for the looks and don't care about the obvious detriment) getting bashed for their opinions? It doesn't make sense. If your opinion is valid then so is ours. However, arguing with blatant lies is kind of ridiculous and is proving nothing good. Just accept that you can't have your cake and eat it too. There are always negatives. I've accepted that my car won't look as pretty as some of the others on CL because I want certain characteristics from my car that can't be had with that look. Acceptance is the first step to recovery my friend.

SChema

iTrader: (2)

For those who say tires have nothing to do with traction and the suspension does it all is like blaming your big brake kit for not stopping very well while running cheap tires.

Comparing traction of an outlaw 10.5 tire to street tires is, well, two different worlds. First off, full slick, different compounds, wrinkle walls, side wall and not too mention electronics such as traction control and boost by gear.

It's very true that a wide tire does not increase traction in a straight line, though it's not the suspension working witchcraft. Look closely at these outloaw 10.5's, tell me what you see in their tire set-ups. The sidewall, the taller side wall allows the tire to wrinkle. Wrinkling increases the threshold before breaking loose; therefore, allowing the tire to "hook" more power. Suspension is a key part of weight transfer and putting the power down to the ground but to say tires don't have much of a role in traction is wrong. It's a healthy balance between suspension set-up and tire set-up. Throw a set of equally sized street tires on one of these outlaw 10.5 cars and see what happens.

scottys209

It's a 400 princess... I'll now explain how tires work so that maybe you'll see how you're wrong, but probably not, because you sir are the ignorant one. Tires work by grip (if you wonder why bald tires slide across a surface it's because there is no tread to "bite in" and grip the surface through compression of the rubber compound)... Back to it, you turn in, the sidewall compresses from pressure while working with the suspension to change dimension and keep maximum amount of tread on the ground, simultaneously the ribs in your tire (generally known as tread) compress as well causing a bite effect to the pavement. Softer compound = more contact and bite with quicker wear, harder = less compression and bite with slower wear (racing teams play with compound differences all the time to maximize run time and grip) so, when you stretch tires, you change the dimensions of the sidewall, and it's ability to flex and compress properly, thus inhibiting the tire to keep contact with the road properly under hard cornering. Under Launch conditions, you will often see 1/4 mi drag cars run low pressure in the rear tires and see the sidewalls collapse massively in order to maximixe the amount of tread that comes in contact with the pavement, thus creating higher traction and less/no wheelspin. On Braking = pretty much the same (over-inflate the tire on your bike tire and then run it at proper inflation and see how it differs in lockup times)... In every way you have inhibited performance over properly fitted tires, all while increasing rotational mass with the larger rim of which you are not gaining contact size that comes with the wider tire meant for that rim. I've provided actual logical explanations to back my point up, you've talked about how you and a few other people run stretched tires and haven't had any problems followed by saying that I know nothing about tires, when you haven't given a single example about it's logically acceptable to manipulate tires and expect proper performance, ride, longevity, and handling. Tire companies spend millions in R&D, and testing to get tire dimesions, proportions, mounting properties, and proper inflation amounts to keep those dimensions correct.... I love how guy's like you think that your seat of the pants testing is anywhere near correct, or even close to as good as those of the engineers who define fitment properties.

For the record, I bought my Lexus with the intent on keeping it stock (with the exception of a few electronics such as HID's and radar detector) because I enjoy the quiet, smooth, comfortable ride, and reliability. I did not buy it to hammer around corners, I have a GSXR for speed. I've had all kinds of sports cars, including an M3 (racing dynamics stage 2), so, yes I know how a car can handle. If I was going to buy a car to build for handling it would start with something ligher, and with better weight distribution. Trust me, I do enjoy my 16" wheel and tire ride, quite a bit....

ArodDaLob

iTrader: (14)

jesus christ so much butt hurt in this thread. if you want to stretch, stretch it, but get it done by an experienced person and check for bubbles, cracks, etc often to reduce chances of getting f-ed up. and please don't try to justify it by saying you're doing it for performance b/c the only performance most people get from stretching tires is a stiffer sidewall, which might be better in a very limited range of cases.
if you don't like stretch, then just don't stretch it. w/ all the fanboi-ism that's around, I think most people know the pro's and con's of stretching tires by now.

different people have different tastes, why the hell can't people just accept that.

and btw, the cyberevo doesn't exactly run meaty tires

and no, they didn't do that to impress the hella bicycle people in norcal. obviously, this is a track car and i'm sure 90% of people who stretch tires don't do it for the geometry that the people who setup the cyberevo were after. jus' sayin'...

SChema

iTrader: (2)

^, Agreed. I do not tell people what to do, I only suggest when asked. It's an individual's car and they can choose to do whatever they want to their cars however they want. Justifying it as a performance advantage is another level. Everyone's knowledge about cars differ. The best we can do is to steer the newer generation in the right direction.

I knew someone was going to post a picture of the Cyber Evo. I one-up you with this.

7sins

This is funny! If you have to stretch your tires at all you purchased a wheel with the wrong offset. I had 18x10 with a 285 on my 240 with a very slight roll in the rear. I just disagree with the whole idea of tire stretching. All it takes is a bit of planning and some measuring and you have a wheel that fits perfect without a stretched tire. You can fit a 305-315 in the rear of an sc with very little work. ...but to eachs own buy a 10" wide wheel and stretch a 195 on it. Its your car do what you like

plex

iTrader: (11)

I put 315's on a 12" wheel on rear of my SC and there was a little "stretch", the stretch was minimal but with 12" I have enough meat to touch the road so I could care less.

On the car


Off the car

MDSC

iTrader: (3)

your 240 would never look like this without stretching no matter how you plan and mesure.



do what you wish but dont tell people its wrong, some people like this look( and alot of people do) and so people dont. Its your car do what you wish, at least we are not putting 24" rims on our SCs and putting 5" lift kits on them.

8600RPM

Wait, hold up a second, the drag racer in me is about to come out...

Have any of you actually looked at a 10.5W tire in person?

And are you aware most outlaw 10.5 guys are running 12-16" wide wheels on those tires?

MDSC

iTrader: (3)

Lol i'm well aware of what 10.5W guys run, i myself had a 94 lt1 stroked/blown/th400 camaro with 725rwhp ran a 9" wide full hoosier slick...its all about how your suspension is set up, some guys can hook on a 26" tire and some guys cant hook on 30x12 slick.

scottys209

Wait, hold up a second, the logical side of you should come out..... There is a MASSIVE difference between street tires and drag slicks.

The "Drag Racer" in you should know that this is greatly due to the fact that the sidewall in Slicks compress greatly, they bow out when doing so, and you DON'T want that close to your fender's when you're pulling a 9 second 1/4 mi. They are allowed to still compress while being stretched because, well, there's a difference between the 40 series tires you're stretching, and the pofile of Drag Radials. What's next? Bringing Mud Tires into the mix?

I heard someone say "at least we're not putting 5in lift's and 24's" dude.... I hate that as much as the next person, maybe more. But I think you just hit the record for hypocrisy. They put lift kits and rim sizes that were never intended for this car with adverse effects to ride, handling, braking and acceleration and look ridiculous to you, you put drop kits and rim sizes that were never intended for this car with adverse effects to ride, handling, braking and acceleration and probably look ridiculous to them.... Yet you have the nerve to talk about not telling people what they should or shouldn't do to their car, or what mods are and aren't wrong, and a general "to each his own" type of statement when following with the exact same type of statement.....

For the record I hate 24's and lift kits on cars....so don't think I'm defending them, but I also hate blatant hypocrisy and general ignorance.

MDSC

iTrader: (3)

Ok how about this, OP asked what tires he should use to stretch on 8.5" rim. Op didnt ask for your opinion, if he should do it or what you think about it. Lets get back to people do what people do, if i see a riced out SC with ebay tailights, a CF hood that has a million of scoops and the guy asks what 22" wheels he should get. I dont like it and i dont go in the thread slamming him telling him hes an idiot and he puts people in danger. I personally dont like it and its not my style so i just shrug my shoulders and stay out of the thread. I suggest you do the same.

8600RPM

Sounds like a nice F-body, I've seen built/Hosed LSx F-body's dead hook on the street with less tire than that up in Chicago and Michigan. You'll get no argument from me about proper suspension geometry and lift points, I've setup quite a few. Mostly Tube frame/4-link cars though.

It took you 2 paragraphs to explain to me...what I've known for 20 years. In both of those lengthy paragraphs, you still didn't answer my questions that were aimed at the people bringing 10.5W tires into the conversation. You sir, are providing me good entertainment today.

MDSC

iTrader: (3)

yep trying to sell whats left of the car on Ls1tech right now, 8 sec longblock.heres my old set up http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/single...-9sec-lt1.html
My plans for the SC are very simple, good looking car with a little bit of HP, na-t with about 400rwhp. I know that no SC will hook with any tire with 400rwhp in 1st or even 2nd no matter what size z rated regular tire youre using. You can run 325s or 245 and you will spin just as much. Run a Dr and then you can hook, which i dont intend on doing. My plans are just to be a reliable cruiser that i can play around on the highway with. I'm just drained from strip set ups and working 100+ hours a week on a car that can go down the track a few times.