Brake failure. Trying to figure out what happened.
01-04-21, 10:33 PM
#31
Pole Position
I pray this horrible failure would not happen to me or others. Wonder if the parking brake would help to stop the car ?
01-05-21, 06:09 AM
#32
Rookie
Thread Starter
01-05-21, 12:16 PM
#34
Rookie
Thread Starter
01-05-21, 03:30 PM
#35
Pole Position
I've not yet had to work on the brakes on my SC either, so I don't know, but I assumed the parking brake/emergency brake is connected via a cable. It is one of the many ways fail-safe braking systems have been designed over the years. That's what makes these complete failures so bizarre. Emergency brake aside, the normal braking system should not fail in a manner that allows the pedal to go to the floor with zero stopping power. With modern ABS systems being so dependent on sensors and computers, however, they may be prone to glitches like this. Yikes!
01-05-21, 05:44 PM
#36
Rookie
Thread Starter
Could that be the difference between a "parking brake" and an "emergency brake?" The parking brake is tied into the normal braking system, but the emergency brake has a mechanical link (cable)? Test driving new cars lately, I noticed they all have electronic parking brakes. Because these are relatively new, and I haven't worked on any, I'm not sure how they're designed.
I've not yet had to work on the brakes on my SC either, so I don't know, but I assumed the parking brake/emergency brake is connected via a cable. It is one of the many ways fail-safe braking systems have been designed over the years. That's what makes these complete failures so bizarre. Emergency brake aside, the normal braking system should not fail in a manner that allows the pedal to go to the floor with zero stopping power. With modern ABS systems being so dependent on sensors and computers, however, they may be prone to glitches like this. Yikes!
I've not yet had to work on the brakes on my SC either, so I don't know, but I assumed the parking brake/emergency brake is connected via a cable. It is one of the many ways fail-safe braking systems have been designed over the years. That's what makes these complete failures so bizarre. Emergency brake aside, the normal braking system should not fail in a manner that allows the pedal to go to the floor with zero stopping power. With modern ABS systems being so dependent on sensors and computers, however, they may be prone to glitches like this. Yikes!
01-06-21, 01:53 AM
#37
Instructor
Guys
The problem you are describing
have to do with the ABS brake accumulator MS unit
in all the SC 430
Our SC430 like the Older GS300-350 and some of the
older Toyota 4 runner use the same ABS MC and all have
the issue where when the unit gets old, the pump might leak
and generally when they do, a loud sound warning would be heard before total breakdown
I have owned 4 SC 430s and they all make an intermediate noise
with the ABS pump . Each time I bring the car in and asked the
Lexus mechanic to look, they would say it is normal operation
That said, this would be the first time I heard where an owner have
not heard any warnings and had total brake failure.
This is concerning. I am wondering if it due to age of the ABS pump
All 4 of my SC had low mileage (30-75K) and this might be why The pump
never went completely out. If you look under my name here, you will see
this has been a topic I brought up a few times.
Hope no one ever gets hurt but maybe it is time Lexus recall all the ABS pump
in the SC 430 before there is someone getting seriously hurt.
BTW, the entire ABS MC is about $3,500 not counting labor
so this might be another reason Lexus IS ignoring this
issue.
The problem you are describing
have to do with the ABS brake accumulator MS unit
in all the SC 430
Our SC430 like the Older GS300-350 and some of the
older Toyota 4 runner use the same ABS MC and all have
the issue where when the unit gets old, the pump might leak
and generally when they do, a loud sound warning would be heard before total breakdown
I have owned 4 SC 430s and they all make an intermediate noise
with the ABS pump . Each time I bring the car in and asked the
Lexus mechanic to look, they would say it is normal operation
That said, this would be the first time I heard where an owner have
not heard any warnings and had total brake failure.
This is concerning. I am wondering if it due to age of the ABS pump
All 4 of my SC had low mileage (30-75K) and this might be why The pump
never went completely out. If you look under my name here, you will see
this has been a topic I brought up a few times.
Hope no one ever gets hurt but maybe it is time Lexus recall all the ABS pump
in the SC 430 before there is someone getting seriously hurt.
BTW, the entire ABS MC is about $3,500 not counting labor
so this might be another reason Lexus IS ignoring this
issue.
Last edited by jonas's RX; 01-06-21 at 08:07 AM.
01-06-21, 06:32 AM
#38
Rookie
Thread Starter
We shall see. Hopefully we get to the bottom of this. I had no warning alarm so mine might be an aberration that extends to the monitoring. We shall see. I am hopeful that Lexus will find the cause and fix it free of charge as the accident could have been much worse. This is my second SC430. The first one I owned from 105K to 190K miles without an ounce of trouble.
01-10-21, 06:17 AM
#39
Lead Lap
By taking it to a dealer, they can document the issue and hopefully get it reported to the right group at their headquarters.
Also, there is an 800 # to call Lexus to express your concerns. Lexus 1-800-255-3987.
I recommend that you do both. It wouldn't hurt to bring the various threads that document your incident and those of the others with you to the dealer. Let us know what you find out.
Also, there is an 800 # to call Lexus to express your concerns. Lexus 1-800-255-3987.
I recommend that you do both. It wouldn't hurt to bring the various threads that document your incident and those of the others with you to the dealer. Let us know what you find out.
01-10-21, 07:07 AM
#40
Rookie
Thread Starter
By taking it to a dealer, they can document the issue and hopefully get it reported to the right group at their headquarters.
Also, there is an 800 # to call Lexus to express your concerns. Lexus 1-800-255-3987.
I recommend that you do both. It wouldn't hurt to bring the various threads that document your incident and those of the others with you to the dealer. Let us know what you find out.
Also, there is an 800 # to call Lexus to express your concerns. Lexus 1-800-255-3987.
I recommend that you do both. It wouldn't hurt to bring the various threads that document your incident and those of the others with you to the dealer. Let us know what you find out.
01-10-21, 11:04 AM
#41
It's brake failures like this that make me question the automotive industry's transition to automatic (electronic) parking/emergency brakes vs the mechanical emergency braking systems.
BTW...When I first got my SC I was used to driving a super-light, 1985 MR2, which stopped on a dime. I almost rear-ended a car that was stopped at a light because I misjudged the stopping distance of our extremely heavy SC's. I kept pressing the brake pedal harder and harder, and stopped within inches of the car's bumper in front of me. It was harrowing! I got used to the extended stopping distance, but would still like to explore upgraded pads/rotors to see if I can get better stopping power with aftermarket parts. Any recommendations of brands would be appreciated. I put EBC brand pads/rotors on my wife's ES and saw a huge improvement, but they are very dust-prone.
BTW...When I first got my SC I was used to driving a super-light, 1985 MR2, which stopped on a dime. I almost rear-ended a car that was stopped at a light because I misjudged the stopping distance of our extremely heavy SC's. I kept pressing the brake pedal harder and harder, and stopped within inches of the car's bumper in front of me. It was harrowing! I got used to the extended stopping distance, but would still like to explore upgraded pads/rotors to see if I can get better stopping power with aftermarket parts. Any recommendations of brands would be appreciated. I put EBC brand pads/rotors on my wife's ES and saw a huge improvement, but they are very dust-prone.
front and back on our ls. Race brakes now
01-10-21, 01:31 PM
#42
Rookie
Thread Starter
Guys
The problem you are describing
have to do with the ABS brake accumulator MS unit
in all the SC 430
Our SC430 like the Older GS300-350 and some of the
older Toyota 4 runner use the same ABS MC and all have
the issue where when the unit gets old, the pump might leak
and generally when they do, a loud sound warning would be heard before total breakdown
I have owned 4 SC 430s and they all make an intermediate noise
with the ABS pump . Each time I bring the car in and asked the
Lexus mechanic to look, they would say it is normal operation
That said, this would be the first time I heard where an owner have
not heard any warnings and had total brake failure.
This is concerning. I am wondering if it due to age of the ABS pump
All 4 of my SC had low mileage (30-75K) and this might be why The pump
never went completely out. If you look under my name here, you will see
this has been a topic I brought up a few times.
Hope no one ever gets hurt but maybe it is time Lexus recall all the ABS pump
in the SC 430 before there is someone getting seriously hurt.
BTW, the entire ABS MC is about $3,500 not counting labor
so this might be another reason Lexus IS ignoring this
issue.
The problem you are describing
have to do with the ABS brake accumulator MS unit
in all the SC 430
Our SC430 like the Older GS300-350 and some of the
older Toyota 4 runner use the same ABS MC and all have
the issue where when the unit gets old, the pump might leak
and generally when they do, a loud sound warning would be heard before total breakdown
I have owned 4 SC 430s and they all make an intermediate noise
with the ABS pump . Each time I bring the car in and asked the
Lexus mechanic to look, they would say it is normal operation
That said, this would be the first time I heard where an owner have
not heard any warnings and had total brake failure.
This is concerning. I am wondering if it due to age of the ABS pump
All 4 of my SC had low mileage (30-75K) and this might be why The pump
never went completely out. If you look under my name here, you will see
this has been a topic I brought up a few times.
Hope no one ever gets hurt but maybe it is time Lexus recall all the ABS pump
in the SC 430 before there is someone getting seriously hurt.
BTW, the entire ABS MC is about $3,500 not counting labor
so this might be another reason Lexus IS ignoring this
issue.
01-10-21, 01:42 PM
#43
Lead Lap
I have already been in touch with Lexus and notified them about this dangerous issue. They will be examining my vehicle once it is out of the body shop. It will be transported to the dealership and someone from corporate will also be in on the examination. Hopefully it will be treated seriously and not swept under the rug.
01-10-21, 05:15 PM
#45
Instructor
Being the car is now over a decade old, it is well documented Lexus in
the past sadly has not honor repair even after a failure.
That said, I think the only way Lexus will repair if there is a class action
lawsuit and someone gets seriously hurt. It would be very
unfortunate if this happen.
good luck DB!
the past sadly has not honor repair even after a failure.
That said, I think the only way Lexus will repair if there is a class action
lawsuit and someone gets seriously hurt. It would be very
unfortunate if this happen.
good luck DB!