SW17LS

My point is the overall shift of sedans to more coupelike profiles. Yes these variants have existed for some time, but they haven't been the norm in the sedan world like they are now.

mmarshall

I agree it's a concession to styling. I'm just one of those people that doesn't always assume that newer is better. Of course, some of the visibility problems with humpback roofs and large pillars are being dealt with by cameras, sensors, and beepers....so it's not always as bad as it seems.

peteharvey

Yes, Mercedes and Mazda started to make lower rooflines in their sedans over 10 years ago.
Lately, under President Akio, Toyota/Lexus has decided to do the same.
All other cars including BMW's continue the trend to becoming bigger and taller.

Interestingly, Mazda did niche and make their cars low and sporty back in the late 1980's before sales plummeted and they went broke, and back to making mainstream tall upright sedans.
Now, Mazda is back into niching low swoopy looking cars again - maybe until sales and profits bite in?

1995-02 E Class.







Back in the late 1980's and early 1990's, Mazda did make niche swoopy sporty derivatives of their sedans, until sales and profits plummeted and they went broke, before Mazda went back to making mainstream tall upright sedans.
Below is the 1993-97 Mazda 323 Portege sedan and 323 Astina 4 door hardtop with a 1.8L V6.

SW17LS

You also have a hard time looking at the industry through a lens that isn't affected by your own preferences

mmarshall

Not as much as you think. My automotive opinions and discussion are not always based on my own preferences. For instance, I've always liked the look of whitewall tires, two-tone paint, hood ornaments, velour seats, and, in some cases, vinyl roofs (as long as they were installed properly and didn't peel off or cause rust LOL). But I accept the idea that many people, even some old-timers, consider them needless frills that don't belong in the 21st Century......so, regardless of my own preferences, I usually don't even discuss them any more, especially in Car Chat.

SW17LS

I've read your posts, your preferences are written all over everything you post

mmarshall

With all due respect, no more than yours. But let's not discuss it any more here......this is not our thread to argue personal policy, but for the OP to help decide on a car purchase. His needs have to come first.

mmarshall

Have you checked out any Subaru products? You say she wants a sedan (and you seem to like some SUVs). The Impreza and Legacy, in particular, combine a sedan's road-manners and style with the all-weather traction of an SUV, at a reasonable price. The only possible glitch I can think of is the CVT transmission, which gives some motor-boat sensations and takes some getting used to. Whether that would or would not be a deal-breaker, of course, would be up to you and her.

MattyG

I'd say the OP lives in California so AWD capability is not needed. But the BRZ could be an interesting but impractical choice. The rest of the Subie line looks pretty boring to me. Unless you need some utility. The Civic hatchback has some odd tail lights in some configurations, but the side profile of the sedan looks pretty darn sleek compared to a Subaru sedan. And the Civic is the sporty choice depending on engines etc. It's a really good looking sedan with sporty driving characteristics. The Accord is now the old man's sedan these days. That's why they style them to have a Bimmer side profile with a Toyota/Lexus ride compromise.

mmarshall

Depends on what part of the state you're in. California's climate varies from semi-tropical desert to some very deep snows in the northern mountains. And AWD is a help in the rain, too....not just snow and ice.



True.....and he said his GF wants a sedan, not a sports car.

Duck05

For the budget you have, if you could get past the "buy new" aspect, take her to go look AND test drive a 2010 or 2011 LS460..... It may be missing some of the exotic tech but it will out class any thing you are considering...

(After all.... this is a Lexus forum and while I had two Civics over 19 years an LS460 is a worthy option....)

nathantse

I've driven almost all Lexus vehicles, used to new (I work @ a dealer part-time). IMO the LS is a giant boat. Yes its luxurious and its a Lexus. (I own a '16 IS350fsport).

But, we are young (23yo), and LS is just too mature lol (And big). Plus, she wants a new car. <-- Can't get past this. If it were solely up to me, I can buy a very nice used car lol

peteharvey

Do you want to keep it long term like 10 to 15 years?
If so, better go Accord.

SW17LS

23 years old, want a fun new car, get the Civic.

If you wouldn't want an LS460 for all those reasons (which I totally understand) why would you want a stodgy Accord?

MattyG

^^^ At 23, yeah life's too short to not have this current generation of Civic, especially the sedan which is a very nicely styled good performing vehicle. You get 174 hp, 7 sec 0-60 and sharp handling plus all the toys. The fact that it almost rivals the outgoing Accord does say something because that car too, has something very pleasing about it.

I agree with you Mike, but the Civic is Canada's best selling sedan for decades until Ford started selling their F150's at reduced prices with deals galore. The Civic has functioned as Canada's default small/medium FWD sedan which happily copes with winters here, so a little bit of flour or icing sugar shouldn't bother it in Cali.