review of tein HA, Flex, and CS coilvers on GS400
03-19-04, 05:20 PM
#31
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man and i asked a few weeks ago about the CS setup didnt get a good reply, so i passed up the offer (500 bucks for CS that had only 1000 miles on it, it was from a friend too)
03-19-04, 05:35 PM
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Originally posted by joshoowa
man and i asked a few weeks ago about the CS setup didnt get a good reply, so i passed up the offer (500 bucks for CS that had only 1000 miles on it, it was from a friend too)
man and i asked a few weeks ago about the CS setup didnt get a good reply, so i passed up the offer (500 bucks for CS that had only 1000 miles on it, it was from a friend too)
On another note,where is that buddy of urs?!! j/k man
03-19-04, 05:59 PM
#33
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I love my HAs! but the time is coming that I have to let them go. 
I drove on my HAs at a really STIFF setting because I didnt want my front tires to keep rubbing on my front fenders. Even with the JP Scaras on, the ride wasn't as bad as I thought it would be. It was still better than my Civic HB on Tanabe Sustec Pros! But we are comparing apples to oranges
I drove on my HAs at a really STIFF setting because I didnt want my front tires to keep rubbing on my front fenders. Even with the JP Scaras on, the ride wasn't as bad as I thought it would be. It was still better than my Civic HB on Tanabe Sustec Pros! But we are comparing apples to oranges
03-19-04, 09:36 PM
#34
Originally posted by Neo
So, if the CS is not a big step better in the categories, why buy it? I think the cumulative effect is large. Other than the above characteristics, the coilovers are lighter, the car can be lowered more, and EDFC adjustability. I may have forgotten something but overall, you are still getting a better system.
So, if the CS is not a big step better in the categories, why buy it? I think the cumulative effect is large. Other than the above characteristics, the coilovers are lighter, the car can be lowered more, and EDFC adjustability. I may have forgotten something but overall, you are still getting a better system.
btw, neo, the cs does NOT lower the car as much as the flex
03-19-04, 09:39 PM
#35
Re: neo coilover review
Originally posted by 3dog
well that convinced me TEIN CS for the wifes car once i get mine finished. i still need a torque converter and new tail lights.
great review
3dog
well that convinced me TEIN CS for the wifes car once i get mine finished. i still need a torque converter and new tail lights.
great review
3dog
03-19-04, 09:39 PM
#36
Originally posted by JunctionGS
I love my HAs! but the time is coming that I have to let them go. I drove on my HAs at a really STIFF setting because I didnt want my front tires to keep rubbing on my front fenders. Even with the JP Scaras on, the ride wasn't as bad as I thought it would be. It was still better than my Civic HB on Tanabe Sustec Pros! But we are comparing apples to oranges
I love my HAs! but the time is coming that I have to let them go.
I drove on my HAs at a really STIFF setting because I didnt want my front tires to keep rubbing on my front fenders. Even with the JP Scaras on, the ride wasn't as bad as I thought it would be. It was still better than my Civic HB on Tanabe Sustec Pros! But we are comparing apples to oranges
03-19-04, 09:40 PM
#37
Originally posted by joshoowa
man and i asked a few weeks ago about the CS setup didnt get a good reply, so i passed up the offer (500 bucks for CS that had only 1000 miles on it, it was from a friend too)
man and i asked a few weeks ago about the CS setup didnt get a good reply, so i passed up the offer (500 bucks for CS that had only 1000 miles on it, it was from a friend too)
03-19-04, 09:41 PM
#39
Originally posted by 04GS300
Guys, one more question....will the CS at a stiffer setting get as stiff as the Flex? I'm sure that it wouldn't get as stiff as Flex at stiff, but will the CS at stiff get as stiff as Flex on say medium? I think I just confused myself!
I just need to get to a meet and beg for some rides to see for myself!
Guys, one more question....will the CS at a stiffer setting get as stiff as the Flex? I'm sure that it wouldn't get as stiff as Flex at stiff, but will the CS at stiff get as stiff as Flex on say medium? I think I just confused myself!
I just need to get to a meet and beg for some rides to see for myself!
03-19-04, 10:34 PM
#41
Originally posted by JunctionGS
I love my HAs! but the time is coming that I have to let them go. I drove on my HAs at a really STIFF setting because I didnt want my front tires to keep rubbing on my front fenders. Even with the JP Scaras on, the ride wasn't as bad as I thought it would be. It was still better than my Civic HB on Tanabe Sustec Pros! But we are comparing apples to oranges
I love my HAs! but the time is coming that I have to let them go.
I drove on my HAs at a really STIFF setting because I didnt want my front tires to keep rubbing on my front fenders. Even with the JP Scaras on, the ride wasn't as bad as I thought it would be. It was still better than my Civic HB on Tanabe Sustec Pros! But we are comparing apples to oranges
There were days when I had my Flex that I really did not want to deal with the ride quality. But then there were also days where I was really glad I had the Flex when I was able to do some hard driving. With the CS, I don't have any days where I dislike the ride quality. On a few rare occasions, I do miss the Flex but not enough to go back. Most of the time, the CS will handle itself well enough.
03-20-04, 04:51 AM
#43
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Originally posted by Neo
Nice write up Rom. I saw it last night when you linked it to me but I've been busy so this is the first chance I've got to respond.
For me, it has always been about adjustability and balance. I needed the adjustability so that I can drive hard when I need to and cruise otherwise. When I first started out modding the car, I made the noobie mistake of thinking I would not get too involved. That was part of the motivation for the L-Tuned S/S combo (and also the warranty factor). Once I added the TRD sways, the car was a bit stiff for everyday driving while it did not handle as nimbly as I would have liked. Plus, there were a few other issues I wanted to address. Enter the TRD front LCB and Tom's rear LCB. The car was almost perfect but it was still stiff sometimes and not enough handling to warrant it.
I then decided to step up to the Flex and "backed off" on the sways by going with Daizen. My thinking was that the Flex has adjustable dampening so I can go soft or stiff based on my mood while also reducing the bumpiness associated with the TRD blues. It almost worked. The Daizens performed as expected. The Flex when on the middle and middle-stiff settings were fantastic. On the days when I was in the mood for some hard driving and did not care about ride quality, I was in heaven. The downside, however, was when I wanted soft, the Flex was soft BUT they also felt somewhat unstable to me. There was more float at the softest setting then even the L-Tuned. I just did not enjoy driving the car at the softest setting.
When I went with the CS, I was a little hesitant since I expected things to be worse than the Flex softest. I had some friends reassure me though that the CS was a different animal and I should not worry. I have found that the CS as perfect as I can expect. Yes the car leans a little more. for me I get in those "driving" moods about 20% of the time. the other 80%, I just want to cruise. With the CS, though, I feel that I have given up only 20% of my handling needs but gaines 80% in ride quality. It has been a long time since I rode in a stock GS and I had an opportunity a month or so ago. The CS is very close to the stock ride but handling-wise, it is no contest.
It has also been awhile since I had my L-Tuned but if I had to make a comparison with the CS:
Hard cornering - CS a bit better but not drastic.
Nimbleness in traffic - CS feels very sure but not leaps over L-Tuned.
Ride quality - I would venture to say that CS is even softer than L-Tuned. It is not the mushy floaty soft but more well-behaved soft. Big ups for the CS here.
In terms of handling, I had the Flex so I was much more impressed with that change from L-Tuned. It is harder to tell how much better the CS is over the L-Tuned since I "backed-down" from the Flex handling-wise.
So, if the CS is not a big step better in the categories, why buy it? I think the cumulative effect is large. Other than the above characteristics, the coilovers are lighter, the car can be lowered more, and EDFC adjustability. I may have forgotten something but overall, you are still getting a better system.
The only caveat I have is that I installed all the lower braces and upper bars. If the standalone CS is handlig deficient in anyway, these bars cover up for it pretty well. I've had all these on except for the rear STB and the Tom's 6-link when I had the L-Tuned. The 6-link was added during the Flex era and the rear STB in the CS era.
Hope this helps, SPORTS.
Nice write up Rom. I saw it last night when you linked it to me but I've been busy so this is the first chance I've got to respond.
For me, it has always been about adjustability and balance. I needed the adjustability so that I can drive hard when I need to and cruise otherwise. When I first started out modding the car, I made the noobie mistake of thinking I would not get too involved. That was part of the motivation for the L-Tuned S/S combo (and also the warranty factor). Once I added the TRD sways, the car was a bit stiff for everyday driving while it did not handle as nimbly as I would have liked. Plus, there were a few other issues I wanted to address. Enter the TRD front LCB and Tom's rear LCB. The car was almost perfect but it was still stiff sometimes and not enough handling to warrant it.
I then decided to step up to the Flex and "backed off" on the sways by going with Daizen. My thinking was that the Flex has adjustable dampening so I can go soft or stiff based on my mood while also reducing the bumpiness associated with the TRD blues. It almost worked. The Daizens performed as expected. The Flex when on the middle and middle-stiff settings were fantastic. On the days when I was in the mood for some hard driving and did not care about ride quality, I was in heaven. The downside, however, was when I wanted soft, the Flex was soft BUT they also felt somewhat unstable to me. There was more float at the softest setting then even the L-Tuned. I just did not enjoy driving the car at the softest setting.
When I went with the CS, I was a little hesitant since I expected things to be worse than the Flex softest. I had some friends reassure me though that the CS was a different animal and I should not worry. I have found that the CS as perfect as I can expect. Yes the car leans a little more. for me I get in those "driving" moods about 20% of the time. the other 80%, I just want to cruise. With the CS, though, I feel that I have given up only 20% of my handling needs but gaines 80% in ride quality. It has been a long time since I rode in a stock GS and I had an opportunity a month or so ago. The CS is very close to the stock ride but handling-wise, it is no contest.
It has also been awhile since I had my L-Tuned but if I had to make a comparison with the CS:
Hard cornering - CS a bit better but not drastic.
Nimbleness in traffic - CS feels very sure but not leaps over L-Tuned.
Ride quality - I would venture to say that CS is even softer than L-Tuned. It is not the mushy floaty soft but more well-behaved soft. Big ups for the CS here.
In terms of handling, I had the Flex so I was much more impressed with that change from L-Tuned. It is harder to tell how much better the CS is over the L-Tuned since I "backed-down" from the Flex handling-wise.
So, if the CS is not a big step better in the categories, why buy it? I think the cumulative effect is large. Other than the above characteristics, the coilovers are lighter, the car can be lowered more, and EDFC adjustability. I may have forgotten something but overall, you are still getting a better system.
The only caveat I have is that I installed all the lower braces and upper bars. If the standalone CS is handlig deficient in anyway, these bars cover up for it pretty well. I've had all these on except for the rear STB and the Tom's 6-link when I had the L-Tuned. The 6-link was added during the Flex era and the rear STB in the CS era.
Hope this helps, SPORTS.
THANKS FOR THE TIME NEO!
Your experience is really helping answer many of my questions. I will not make my final decision until my RMM STB, TRD LCB and TOM'S LCB are installed on the car. I will compare the effect of these with my initial suspension mods and go from there. An interesting comment on TRD vs DAIZEN sways (I know this topic has been debated many times). I am wondering whether the ride quality will improve for me as much as it did for you with the CS as I am going to keep the TRD sways?
Thanks again.
Mario
03-20-04, 05:49 AM
#44
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Keep in mind that there's *2* parts that contribute to the ride/handling trade-off - the springs and the dampers. The Flex springs are pretty stiff. The dampers (shocks) affect how the car rebounds from sudden transitions, and the springs have more to do with body roll in corners I think. So different coilovers might given different responses compared to another type in different situations and similar responses in others, so to always say one is stiffer than an another isn't necessarily true.
The dampers on my Flex (and on CS), have a lot of adjustability, from very stiff, and very little rebound (IF ANY), to basically floaty with a larger amount of travel. This is balanced with the springs, which I'd say are fairly stiff, and probably a bit stiffer than the L-Tuned springs. I'd expect the CS springs are a bit softer, and of course the CS has the rubber mounts (like L-Tuned) vs. the metal ones the Flex has. The CS dampers are probably the same or very similar.
The dampers on my Flex (and on CS), have a lot of adjustability, from very stiff, and very little rebound (IF ANY), to basically floaty with a larger amount of travel. This is balanced with the springs, which I'd say are fairly stiff, and probably a bit stiffer than the L-Tuned springs. I'd expect the CS springs are a bit softer, and of course the CS has the rubber mounts (like L-Tuned) vs. the metal ones the Flex has. The CS dampers are probably the same or very similar.
03-20-04, 07:27 AM
#45
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This is a really great thread, IMO its worthy of a sticky, just think how much $$$ joshoowa could have saved if he would have had this info readily availible! LOL