chuckb

no prob....
it should be night and day difference once you set the dampening right. the way you had it set was like riding around with blown shocks, you were driving with no dampening, all spring.....

cpone

How do you know if you are getting the V2 of the CST's or the old version?
I am asking because I am buying a pair and want to make sure they dont give me the old one and try to play it off like its the right one.

Thanks.

chuckb

the new ones are made of black steel w/gold perches, the originals are aluminum and all gold.

rominl

iTrader: (4)

exactly, having less lean is good, but having no lean is never a good idea. even the m5/m6 has lean. even porsche has lean. the overall balance of the car is the key, that's why m5 has such superb handling. you can always just use a bar and completely weld the left and right side, that's the stiffest sway bar you can get, but that doesn't give you the best handling

RMMGS4

iTrader: (5)

Thanks for emphasizing that Neo. You have to look at sways in a similar way we do shocks & springs.

In the real world a compliant suspension is necessary and allows for better handling on non-perfect road surfaces.

I actually look forward to a semi-bumpy corner, cuz my car now has more compliance and it stays in contact with the ground much better than before when I had a stiffer suspension.

If you want to eliminate lean, you end up with a go-kart. Hit a small pot hole at high speed and watch em fly.

Panerai127

Sorry guys, I think you got me missunderstood. I know the car has to have a lean Rom, otherwise it would be a go-kart. I just read on CL that Tein CS with Daizen sways is not the best combo and has more lean and a bit worse handling then Tein CS with TRD sways, since they are stiffer and would acomodate the CS better then Daizen.. Since CS are smoother then Flex or PSS (I assume). With Flex or PSS Dazien would maybe work better. I am woundering how DaveGS4's car feels with full suspension on PSS and TRD sways.. He says it would outhandle M5's, and road feel is close to BMW, I read his responses somewhere on older threads some time back.

Chuck, I readjusted my CS today the right way, I am so upset at my mech that he did not know anything about this car or Tein when he installed it. I will never do any work on my car at any shop that does not sell the products I am getting or the mech has to have a Lexus.. So I turned all adjusters clockwise to the stiffest setting and then turned counter-clockwise 4 clicks in the back and 2 clicks in the front.. Feels much better and leans much less, I am mutch happier now.. If on Monday I get my car 99% and I will end up keeping it, I will order TRD sways.. And then will see how this baby does on the road, and will start shopping for wheels. (I have Axis Milano or MRR HR2 20" in mind with 235/35 and 275/30). Thanks everyone for input and saving my CS's since I had this set out of spec..

RMMGS4

iTrader: (5)

Well you know that's just one persons opinion. Verified by what means, lean-o-meter, butt-o-meter? No lap times, g-force, skid pad measurments?

If no empirical data, then it is entirely subjective, making the advice worth only as much as the credentials of the person making the comment. Credentials: i.e. - Race car driver, engineer, Nascar Crew chief, F1 shock dynomometer engineer, college student, reads a lot?

Do a search using screen names - DoubleWhoosh & Ron430. These are two opposing opinions, from people with respectable credentials.


I'm not saying I dis-agree with the statement, it is just an opinion after all, but there's so much more to this then just making a simple comment, without factoring in all the variables. Do a search on 3 years worth of comments about Daizen sways and TRD, then decide for yourself.

Try something out and let us know what "your" driving impressions are.

Good Luck

cliffud

iTrader: (3)

Maybe we can have Todd chime in on this???

Neo

iTrader: (3)

Of course Todd can if he wants to but I doubt it. He went a few rounds with the TRD vs Daizen debate. I am not sure he'd want to rehash it. It is just too hard to quantify. Even if someone did all the testing and got all the numbers, it just cannot factor in personal preference, tolerance, and experience. Over the years, we each learn what we like, don't like, and the threshold for the compromise between the two. Unfortunately, something that is too tame and soft for one person will be too stiff and harsh for another.

When we get opinions, we are getting ones based on how the car is setup, road quality, and the person's overall experience. Whether or not all that directly translates to our individual tastes is a big question.

All these bracing affect ride quality and handling on straight driving, turns, smooth roads, bumpy roads, ... One person can put up with a little less handling for a less bumpy ride on rough roads whereas another can care less that they are tossing around on bad roads but can fly around corners like a go-kart.

Remember also that even with all the bracing, tire compound/grip, wheel spec (tire sidewall construction and height, rims spec), alignment spec can all contribute to the feel of the car. It is too simplified to say coilover1 + sways1 is better than coilover2 + sway2.

cpone

Thanks man. Now I know what to look for.

RMMGS4

iTrader: (5)

Thanks again Chris for adding to what I said. That's pretty much how I look at it as well.

You're right as well that measurments alone cannot solely determine your decisions. It WILL quantify to some extent if brand x is better than brand y on road course z. NO ONE has performed such testing to my knowledge. That being the case, I cannot give much credibility to most of those who claim that brand x is better than y.

99.9% of the sway bar purchasers will never race their car on a road course, so those placing such a heavy factor on which has "better" performance should probably give less importance to it than they do.

For those who drive their cars to 110% of the limit on the street , track or otherwise, they should be the only people who should care greatly about performance, but for the rest of us, I'd suggest they base more of their decision making on maintaining ride quality.


OK, I've given way more than my allotted 2 cents.
Chris, I wish I had the time to elaborate as you do.

lexforlife

iTrader: (7)

bro imo for what you are after you need to upgrade to at least 18in wheels staggered. you need more tire contact and lower profile to get the road feel you are after, personally i think you should go after the flexs and daizen combo , they work well the trd cs combo is going to opposite ends of the spectrum where the cs is tuned more for comfort you cant make up its short comings by adding a stiff as hell sway bar,


glenn said it best , the objectve here is balance , you want you suspension to be dynamically balanced , then you can acheive the merits of a german road car


since going to the flexs i had to loosen up some links and adjust my rear sways for a better match , i like the fact that on the flex i can play around with the preload until i find the ride and handling i desire

lexforlife

iTrader: (7)

uh glenn this would be me hands down

RMMGS4

iTrader: (5)

Hey Ed, long time no chat.

Good to hear comment's from a "110 percenter".

Panerai127

Guys, I agree 100% with you on all these points. By the way I just drove about 20 miles on my newly adjusted CS and I love it.. I take it back as far as getting Flex or PSS instead. If I would keep this car, I would just add sways and I think this would be what I need in this car, as you all said we do not race our cars on race course, therefore we do not need them to be like go-karts. I just wanted the car to feel more in control then stock, not floaty and lean less and feel more like BMW sport package, that is all. I do agree with people and their personal opinions and what feels good or bad for one would not necessary be for another! Since I do not have time or money to try all these parts out. I was just trying to find someone that loves BMW feel and try to see what they did to their GS to come close to the feel of bimmer, which is what I love, that is all.. What I realize more and more, there are also alot of people here on CL that love Lexus plush floaty ride and do not like BMW feel and that is why they are proud Lexus owners.. lol.. When I was ordering parts from Todd, I bugged him with all these questions, and he told me that, if I would get Tein CS, bushing kit, and sways (he did not mention which) I would handle better then sport package BMW and closer to M5, and now after I adjusted my Tein's to where they need to be, sways (I am leaning towards TRD) would just complete the package for me, where I would be satisfied and all the other braces and links is just not necessary for me (i hope, lol), since as you said I would never take it to track. I spoke to one member here though, who has Tein CS and had Daizen sways as his only mods, he said the sways did not go well with Teins, and when he switched to TRD he was much happier and he did not experience as much lean as Daizen nor they were a lot harsher of a ride then Daizen, just worked better with CS and the car was perfect and very close to BMW feel. I just hope this mech at Z-Tech in Longwood, FL where I am going on monday would get my car 99% fixed, with all little clunks I have, and a bit of loose steering feel, etc.. I found him here from some refrences from members and he himself has LS430, so I hope he would do some miracles on my ride, it is just so frustrating, as you all know how much work and money I spent on this car and it is still not 100%..