TRD Sportivo Sways
10-14-03, 12:12 PM
#31
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Originally posted by RON430
Wonderful. You know, upon reflection last night, I realized that you really are quite amusing. Thirty one years ago I had just returned from Germany where we had made input to the factory on the cars we were building for the 73 Can Am and the last word I would apply to them was jalopy.
Seeing as how no one is particularly interested in Sportivo stabilizer bars, I guess we can skip any further input.
Wonderful. You know, upon reflection last night, I realized that you really are quite amusing. Thirty one years ago I had just returned from Germany where we had made input to the factory on the cars we were building for the 73 Can Am and the last word I would apply to them was jalopy.
Seeing as how no one is particularly interested in Sportivo stabilizer bars, I guess we can skip any further input.
your bias against daizen or polyrurethnae is truly baffling
10-14-03, 12:26 PM
#32
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Originally posted by CrazeeSC
This is 2003, sorry!
your bias against daizen or polyrurethnae is truly baffling
This is 2003, sorry!
your bias against daizen or polyrurethnae is truly baffling
"CrazeeSC: Non-interesting read, it doesn't even make sense.
That your previous post was deleted speaks for itself."
I understand it was too much for you to go back and see what the topic of this thread is about. Evidently Daizen is your preferred vendor (as posted here and other threads) and that makes your posts and comments make sense. What a wonderful company they must be to have their products defended so expertly by you.
10-14-03, 02:25 PM
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it is evident when u like something, and even more so when you dont then you say it's commercial or something funny how everything is ok when you do it but not when others do
like i said before u said that the bilsteins are so perfect, then you buy a new car and they are no good but the other bilstines are good but meanwhile no other shocks are good. then your blue trd are good but daizens cant be cuz they have urethane bushings and then trd has different bars and those are good too
this is whyy your opinions dont make sense and will confuse people that need information
you constantly talk about things you havent tested and when other people test them you say they are biased or commercial
at least they tested them all, your tests are the only biased ones by the evidence of your own comments
like i said before u said that the bilsteins are so perfect, then you buy a new car and they are no good but the other bilstines are good but meanwhile no other shocks are good. then your blue trd are good but daizens cant be cuz they have urethane bushings and then trd has different bars and those are good too
this is whyy your opinions dont make sense and will confuse people that need information
you constantly talk about things you havent tested and when other people test them you say they are biased or commercial
at least they tested them all, your tests are the only biased ones by the evidence of your own comments
10-14-03, 03:01 PM
#34
Moderator
OK guys can we let this drop already? 
Can we get back to the topic before a mod locks this up?
Back to reality.....I have put of ordering sways because no one has done a quantitive review of all 3 mentioned here. If I had access to all 3 bars I would ...but I dont.
Crazysc have you done any tests with all 3 or just the Daizens? Any unbaised feedback?
Can we get back to the topic before a mod locks this up? Back to reality.....I have put of ordering sways because no one has done a quantitive review of all 3 mentioned here. If I had access to all 3 bars I would ...but I dont.
Crazysc have you done any tests with all 3 or just the Daizens? Any unbaised feedback?
10-14-03, 03:27 PM
#35
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Originally posted by CrazeeSC
it is evident when u like something, and even more so when you dont then you say it's commercial or something funny how everything is ok when you do it but not when others do
like i said before u said that the bilsteins are so perfect, then you buy a new car and they are no good but the other bilstines are good but meanwhile no other shocks are good. then your blue trd are good but daizens cant be cuz they have urethane bushings and then trd has different bars and those are good too
this is whyy your opinions dont make sense and will confuse people that need information
you constantly talk about things you havent tested and when other people test them you say they are biased or commercial
at least they tested them all, your tests are the only biased ones by the evidence of your own comments
it is evident when u like something, and even more so when you dont then you say it's commercial or something funny how everything is ok when you do it but not when others do
like i said before u said that the bilsteins are so perfect, then you buy a new car and they are no good but the other bilstines are good but meanwhile no other shocks are good. then your blue trd are good but daizens cant be cuz they have urethane bushings and then trd has different bars and those are good too
this is whyy your opinions dont make sense and will confuse people that need information
you constantly talk about things you havent tested and when other people test them you say they are biased or commercial
at least they tested them all, your tests are the only biased ones by the evidence of your own comments
Last edited by RON430; 10-14-03 at 03:29 PM.
10-14-03, 03:33 PM
#36
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Originally posted by Letsride
OK guys can we let this drop already? Can we get back to the topic before a mod locks this up?
Back to reality.....I have put of ordering sways because no one has done a quantitive review of all 3 mentioned here. If I had access to all 3 bars I would ...but I dont.
Crazysc have you done any tests with all 3 or just the Daizens? Any unbaised feedback?
OK guys can we let this drop already?
Can we get back to the topic before a mod locks this up? Back to reality.....I have put of ordering sways because no one has done a quantitive review of all 3 mentioned here. If I had access to all 3 bars I would ...but I dont.
Crazysc have you done any tests with all 3 or just the Daizens? Any unbaised feedback?
10-14-03, 03:41 PM
#37
Originally posted by Letsride
OK guys can we let this drop already? Can we get back to the topic before a mod locks this up?
OK guys can we let this drop already?
Can we get back to the topic before a mod locks this up?
Originally posted by Letsride
Back to reality.....I have put of ordering sways because no one has done a quantitive review of all 3 mentioned here. If I had access to all 3 bars I would ...but I dont.
Crazysc have you done any tests with all 3 or just the Daizens? Any unbaised feedback?
Back to reality.....I have put of ordering sways because no one has done a quantitive review of all 3 mentioned here. If I had access to all 3 bars I would ...but I dont.
Crazysc have you done any tests with all 3 or just the Daizens? Any unbaised feedback?
Since there is now a choice, many who like to maintain the Lexus feel go for either Daizens od Sportivos. The ones that are swapping out are the people who bough the Race ones since there were no other option at the time.
Because of this, it would be difficult to find someone who has tested all three. I know that Todd did a lot of research into the sways and cut up a number of them. I know he has tested ride issues with the Race and the Daizens but I am not sure if he drove a car with the Sportivos. Maybe he can clarify.
I have enjoyed Ron's posts since he took a different approach to modding the suspension. He stayed with the stock wheels and upgraded the s/s and added sways. He likes the results and felt little ride compromise. I liked the TRD Race sways a lot and I agree that on nice roads, you can't really feel the Race sways. On bad roads, I did not have the same experience. Many of us went to larger wheels, stiffer s/s or coilovers, bracing everywhere, ... I fall somewhat in this latter category so I decided to "back down" the bracing of the sways. I have not regretted it.
I am a Daizen fan so no need to make a believer out of me but Ron has his approach to his cars and it makes him happy. So what if he has not tried Daizens and don't plan to. No one can expect him to spend his $ just to satisfy the rest of our curiosity. He gives a unique opinion on the differences between the Race and the Sportivos. There are a bunch of us who can give opinions on the Race vs. Daizens. Unless someone wants to step up and spend the time and money, this is as good as we are going to get.
10-14-03, 03:59 PM
#38
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Originally posted by Neo
I agree.
I think most people here have only swapped out 2 sets of sways: Race/Sportivo or Race/Daizen. I fall in the latter. At $500 a pop, I don't think many if any will go Sportivo<->Daizen. These two are based on similar concepts: better handling with minimal ride degradation. As most recent as last year, we all had only one chooice: TRD Race. No one tried out the Sportivos. Daizen sways were not available.
Since there is now a choice, many who like to maintain the Lexus feel go for either Daizens od Sportivos. The ones that are swapping out are the people who bough the Race ones since there were no other option at the time.
Because of this, it would be difficult to find someone who has tested all three. I know that Todd did a lot of research into the sways and cut up a number of them. I know he has tested ride issues with the Race and the Daizens but I am not sure if he drove a car with the Sportivos. Maybe he can clarify.
I have enjoyed Ron's posts since he took a different approach to modding the suspension. He stayed with the stock wheels and upgraded the s/s and added sways. He likes the results and felt little ride compromise. I liked the TRD Race sways a lot and I agree that on nice roads, you can't really feel the Race sways. On bad roads, I did not have the same experience. Many of us went to larger wheels, stiffer s/s or coilovers, bracing everywhere, ... I fall somewhat in this latter category so I decided to "back down" the bracing of the sways. I have not regretted it.
I am a Daizen fan so no need to make a believer out of me but Ron has his approach to his cars and it makes him happy. So what if he has not tried Daizens and don't plan to. No one can expect him to spend his $ just to satisfy the rest of our curiosity. He gives a unique opinion on the differences between the Race and the Sportivos. There are a bunch of us who can give opinions on the Race vs. Daizens. Unless someone wants to step up and spend the time and money, this is as good as we are going to get.
I agree.
I think most people here have only swapped out 2 sets of sways: Race/Sportivo or Race/Daizen. I fall in the latter. At $500 a pop, I don't think many if any will go Sportivo<->Daizen. These two are based on similar concepts: better handling with minimal ride degradation. As most recent as last year, we all had only one chooice: TRD Race. No one tried out the Sportivos. Daizen sways were not available.
Since there is now a choice, many who like to maintain the Lexus feel go for either Daizens od Sportivos. The ones that are swapping out are the people who bough the Race ones since there were no other option at the time.
Because of this, it would be difficult to find someone who has tested all three. I know that Todd did a lot of research into the sways and cut up a number of them. I know he has tested ride issues with the Race and the Daizens but I am not sure if he drove a car with the Sportivos. Maybe he can clarify.
I have enjoyed Ron's posts since he took a different approach to modding the suspension. He stayed with the stock wheels and upgraded the s/s and added sways. He likes the results and felt little ride compromise. I liked the TRD Race sways a lot and I agree that on nice roads, you can't really feel the Race sways. On bad roads, I did not have the same experience. Many of us went to larger wheels, stiffer s/s or coilovers, bracing everywhere, ... I fall somewhat in this latter category so I decided to "back down" the bracing of the sways. I have not regretted it.
I am a Daizen fan so no need to make a believer out of me but Ron has his approach to his cars and it makes him happy. So what if he has not tried Daizens and don't plan to. No one can expect him to spend his $ just to satisfy the rest of our curiosity. He gives a unique opinion on the differences between the Race and the Sportivos. There are a bunch of us who can give opinions on the Race vs. Daizens. Unless someone wants to step up and spend the time and money, this is as good as we are going to get.
10-14-03, 06:01 PM
#39
Moderator
Ron no appologies needed
Neo, I had no intentions of having Ron go out and spend more money on Daizen sways. My whole thing was IF he could get his hands on some that would shed some light (one person's opinion) on the different attributes of each bar since he would have had all 3.
Ron, I am unbaised here since I do not have any aftermarket sways installed and I have been using this post in my research. If I have offended you with any of the questions/suggestions that I have brought up; my sincere appologies.
Neo, I had no intentions of having Ron go out and spend more money on Daizen sways. My whole thing was IF he could get his hands on some that would shed some light (one person's opinion) on the different attributes of each bar since he would have had all 3.
Ron, I am unbaised here since I do not have any aftermarket sways installed and I have been using this post in my research. If I have offended you with any of the questions/suggestions that I have brought up; my sincere appologies.
10-14-03, 06:30 PM
#40
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Originally posted by Letsride
Ron no appologies needed
Neo, I had no intentions of having Ron go out and spend more money on Daizen sways. My whole thing was IF he could get his hands on some that would shed some light (one person's opinion) on the different attributes of each bar since he would have had all 3.
Ron, I am unbaised here since I do not have any aftermarket sways installed and I have been using this post in my research. If I have offended you with any of the questions/suggestions that I have brought up; my sincere appologies.
Ron no appologies needed
Neo, I had no intentions of having Ron go out and spend more money on Daizen sways. My whole thing was IF he could get his hands on some that would shed some light (one person's opinion) on the different attributes of each bar since he would have had all 3.
Ron, I am unbaised here since I do not have any aftermarket sways installed and I have been using this post in my research. If I have offended you with any of the questions/suggestions that I have brought up; my sincere appologies.
In any event, I was only trying to help and give some flavor for the differences to be expected between the TRD blues and Sportivos. For now I have enough bars stacked up in the garage. Anybody want some stock stabilizer bars? Cheap.
10-14-03, 06:57 PM
#41
Lexus Test Driver
Originally posted by Neo
Because of this, it would be difficult to find someone who has tested all three. I know that Todd did a lot of research into the sways and cut up a number of them. I know he has tested ride issues with the Race and the Daizens but I am not sure if he drove a car with the Sportivos. Maybe he can clarify.
I am a Daizen fan so no need to make a believer out of me but Ron has his approach to his cars and it makes him happy. So what if he has not tried Daizens and don't plan to. No one can expect him to spend his $ just to satisfy the rest of our curiosity. He gives a unique opinion on the differences between the Race and the Sportivos. There are a bunch of us who can give opinions on the Race vs. Daizens. Unless someone wants to step up and spend the time and money, this is as good as we are going to get.
Because of this, it would be difficult to find someone who has tested all three. I know that Todd did a lot of research into the sways and cut up a number of them. I know he has tested ride issues with the Race and the Daizens but I am not sure if he drove a car with the Sportivos. Maybe he can clarify.
I am a Daizen fan so no need to make a believer out of me but Ron has his approach to his cars and it makes him happy. So what if he has not tried Daizens and don't plan to. No one can expect him to spend his $ just to satisfy the rest of our curiosity. He gives a unique opinion on the differences between the Race and the Sportivos. There are a bunch of us who can give opinions on the Race vs. Daizens. Unless someone wants to step up and spend the time and money, this is as good as we are going to get.
So sad that someone can claim to be such an authority, when they have not tried nor tested everything before coming to conclusions. Even if I said the TRD were good (which I have) he will still say I am commercially biased.
His comments about the GS300 being so different is already showing that he doesn't even have the data to know if the part numbers are the same for a 300/400/430, what years they changed them (if they did at all), which cars have different sway bars or bushings, which car is heavier and by how much, etc. And that's just the OEM parts! This doesn't include the aftermarket and all different combinations. Trust me I have ALL this data and then some. Being thorough is the key, not buying a couple sets of shocks and bars and using your butt. When you do work for OEM (which we do here all the time) they want no questions unanswered, so I am in the habit of making sure all possibilities are checked, tested, rechecked, and retested. Just because I pretend I don't have all the information doesn't mean I don't have it all either. Some of this information is not anything that I have the right to freely blab away.
He's the reason I keep a lot of useful information to myself nowdays, that I would be more than happy to share with everyone!
Luckily a LOT of people PM or email, those people are very welcoming of any information that we have gathered along the way, and I can tell you that they are not too fond of his ways or his demeanor.
Just my objective $.02
10-14-03, 07:14 PM
#42
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iTrader: (2)
Hey guys lets keep it nice and civil, OK?
Todd - how about starting a new thread with Sportivo vs Daizen - your observations? I'd guess you are the only person with any experience on those two.
Todd - how about starting a new thread with Sportivo vs Daizen - your observations? I'd guess you are the only person with any experience on those two.
10-15-03, 05:21 AM
#43
dave , i am sorry but i have to dive in , i tried to resist but ron (no offense bro ) has made it impossible.
i have to agree with todd on this topic , notbecause i have the daizen equipment , but i have tried both bars and this my opinion have concluded in prior threads which one was overall superior. Overall being the operative word.. No one component is going to deliver 100% all the time , but will reach a happy medium. my findings are not only based on actually usage , but from actually meeting and talking extensively with fortune , the owner of Daizen in person.. defend Daizen , i am not , put given this ongoing debate , i see no supportive postings or even a attempt to post any actual information on behalf of anyone from trd , toyota etc , to support their products.. it appears their idea is put a product out there that has been tested on the track for track like driving and if they like great and if not too bad.. Their products work , and work well indeed if you are driving on the track or track like conditions all the time .. i dont know about you but racing all the time is quite dangerous on public roads so we all drive like regular people most of the time with the knowledge of what we have underneath can do , but we still must maintain some level of comfort , i mean afterall we bought a luxury sports sedan..
Ron your postings are somewhat informative , but very very biased , you give the impression to others that you are the authority on any topic relating to these cars and those of the past.. it appears to be confusing to the masses especially new members/owners looking to make a decision. unless you are a automobile engineer , please IMO posts actual data and not specualtions or long drawn out ideas with big words to impress no one..
people like todd or steve have the technical background and racing exp to really post actual data to be helpful . lets leave it to them to post actual tech data , and we novices post out butt-o-meter exper ..
and my butt and back says DAIZEN baby
i have to agree with todd on this topic , notbecause i have the daizen equipment , but i have tried both bars and this my opinion have concluded in prior threads which one was overall superior. Overall being the operative word.. No one component is going to deliver 100% all the time , but will reach a happy medium. my findings are not only based on actually usage , but from actually meeting and talking extensively with fortune , the owner of Daizen in person.. defend Daizen , i am not , put given this ongoing debate , i see no supportive postings or even a attempt to post any actual information on behalf of anyone from trd , toyota etc , to support their products.. it appears their idea is put a product out there that has been tested on the track for track like driving and if they like great and if not too bad.. Their products work , and work well indeed if you are driving on the track or track like conditions all the time .. i dont know about you but racing all the time is quite dangerous on public roads so we all drive like regular people most of the time with the knowledge of what we have underneath can do , but we still must maintain some level of comfort , i mean afterall we bought a luxury sports sedan..
Ron your postings are somewhat informative , but very very biased , you give the impression to others that you are the authority on any topic relating to these cars and those of the past.. it appears to be confusing to the masses especially new members/owners looking to make a decision. unless you are a automobile engineer , please IMO posts actual data and not specualtions or long drawn out ideas with big words to impress no one..
people like todd or steve have the technical background and racing exp to really post actual data to be helpful . lets leave it to them to post actual tech data , and we novices post out butt-o-meter exper ..
and my butt and back says DAIZEN baby